Freedom Debate!

Yesterday, the Libertarian Party nominated Bob Barr to be their Presidential candidate. I watched a bit of the convention itself, and came away with some interesting observations, which I may post about some other time. But for now, I’d actually like to rewind to the day before the nomination – the Libertarian Party debate which included seven of the candidates: Bob Barr, Mary Ruwart, Wayne Allyn Root, George Phillies, Michael Jingozian, Steve Kubby, and Mike Gravel.

I’ve certainly had my fun at the expense of the Libertarians, but it isn’t really my fault — they keep giving me fresh material. So, for the record, this run-through of the debate (available in full at C-Span Junkie) is not intended to offer their substantive arguments: the substance in this summary is mainly incidental. Want to know what they stand for, read Reason Magazine — they have plenty of their own debate analysis. I already know what I think of the Libbies, so I just wanted to continue the fun…

Opening Statements

Bob Barr (BB): “People say I’m uncharismatic, but inside this heart beats the heart of a Libertarian.” See? He admits right off the bat that the heart of a Libbie is small enough to fit inside another heart. Honesty.

Mike Gravel (MG): “Freedom! Freedom! Freedom!” Seriously… he said that. And I was worried that a sit-down debate would keep him from having a stage-wandering Stockdale moment.

George Phillies (GP): Wow… what a personally unappealing and unlikeable man. Ran for Congress in Massachusetts in ‘98, was involved in the debates, “the press said I won them.” “I’m the centrist Libertarian.” Too much Left Libbie/Right Libbie splits. Keep Uncle Sam out of pocket-book and bedroom; GOP has exposed themselves as the Party of bigots. And to top it all off: “I will give us the campaign you’ve always dreamed of.” Modest guy.

Wayne Allyn Root (WAR): Another man of whom I developed an instant and instinctive aversion. Seriously, a Phillies/Root ticket might have been the most unlikeable ticket in the history of politics. “I’m going to make history for our Party.”

Michael Jingosian (MJ): “It’s so nice to be in a room with so many who care about liberty and freedom.” Unlike the rest of the Stalinists in the U.S.? He’s been a Libbie since 1980. Don’t really know why — just something about realizing the two-party system controlled everything. Oh — this is priceless… he cares so deeply for his country that he’s been on the road, forced to talk to his kids on the phone long distance, willing to “sacrifice so much” for the country he loves. Hey, I’m not asking for military service or anything, but at least Romney’s kids sacrificed for this country by campaigning for him.

Steve Kubby (SK): Has some kind of aggressive form of cancer, and was given six months to live. Has had that prognosis for 34 years. I’m happy for the man, but remain unconvinced that medical marijuana, while undoubtedly pain relieving, is the reason for his survival. Sort of a “kids, don’t try this at home” moment, but I would recommend that cancer patients actually get treatment, perhaps in addition to the medical marijuana thing.

Mary Ruwart (MR): Vote for me, I’m a woman… just like Hillary Clinton… only not at all like Hillary Clinton.

Question One: Favorite Philosopher

Quick digression: I hate this question… hate it when its asked in a Democratic debate, a Republican debate, and probably especially in a Libertarian debate. It’s ridiculous.

BB: First respondent gets the worm! “Ayn Rand.” Take that, rest of the participants!

MG: “Solon,” the Athenian lawmaker and poet. Took the words right out of my mouth.

GP: “Barry Goldwater.” Wait, that answer didn’t get the applause I was hoping for… plan B: “Cicero!” Then, I kid you not, “most of you probably haven’t heard of him.” Real respect for your audience, professor.

MJ: “Benjamin Franklin.” I’m predicting this is just the first shot in an “I heart 1776″ theme for the day.

MR: “Ayn Rand.” Oooh… too bad its taken. Don’t get much of a response going second, I guess.

Kubby: “David Nolan, founder of the U.S. Libertarian Party.” I think he was a contemporary of Cicero… maybe Phillies can help me out on that one.

WAR: “Yogi Berra.” Seriously, what a dick. Oh! And, “Barry Goldwater.”

MG: Second consecutive statement in which he invokes the Military Industrial Complex. We could be in for a long day.

GP: Stop shouting! You have a microphone! What a grating little lecture-y voice! While we’re at it, stop with the soundbite sentences: “Bring troops home!” “End the war!” There are available sentences that don’t begin with verbs.

MJ: Ooh, he just stole Gravel’s Military Industrial Complex. Also, it’s a primary, this guy needs to stop preaching to the choir and pleading with his audience to vote Libertarian in 2008.

Question Two: Foreign Entanglements

SK: “We don’t have enemies, we have ideological competitors.” Um, okay, but it seems to me we have a few enemies as well.

WAR: Now his hero is Jefferson – sorry Goldwater and Berra. He’s only anti-war because of his economic conservatism. These guys sure are a warm and fuzzy crowd.

GP: When you add together incoherence and ego, you get George Phillies: “I’ve called for…” and then a whole lotta nothing. Something about private enterprise, but he lost me along the way.

MJ: “I agree with George Phillies” (you could follow that?). Another plea to vote Libertarian.

MR: Put true cost of oil at market price.

SK: What the hell is that sound coming from Kubby’s mike??? Every time he speaks now it sounds like a snake charmer in the background combined with a series of “door open” beeps. I can’t even listen to what he’s saying.

Question Three: Energy Policy

WAR: “Politicians aren’t the solution, they’re the problem.” Way to go out on a limb. “Drill, Drill, Drill!” And a shot at Al Gore. Doesn’t seem like Root is all that concerned about global warming.

BB: “I have nothing against polar bears.” Good to know, that’d make a great bumper sticker.

MG: “Had the same problems thirty years ago, and government did nothing.” ??? Um… Clean Air Act, Clean Water Act, Environmental Protection Agency, Earth Day, most effective environmental measures since TR was in office.

Question Four: Tragedy of the Commons

MJ: “I’m going to do something politicians never do: say ‘I don’t know.’” Wow – a good minute in, and he’s still talking about how great it is that he admitted he didn’t know the answer. Move on.

MR: She said taxes! Then she retracted. Then she said “fee!” Why do I doubt that will play well?

SK: “U.S. government worst polluters on planet.”

WAR: “And the second biggest polluter is Al Gore.” Is this a vendetta he has or something?

BB: Don’t sign Kyoto. Does anyone remember what the question was?

MG: “The only thing that works is the concept of private property.” Keep telling yourself that, Mike.

GP: Come on… do we have to listen to your “liberals on one side, conservatives on the other, I’m somewhere else, and I’m the only one who’s right” argument again? We get it. Brave, brilliant, and always correct. And not the least bit incoherent.

Question Five: PATRIOT Act and REAL ID

MR: Abolish them both. Only people who “understood” the Patriot Act were Ron Paul and “myself.” Sorry, Feingold, guess you didn’t make the cut. Then… “if everyone was armed, there would’ve been no 9/11.”

SK: Attacks Barr on vote for Patriot Act. Government wants to “track and control us.” Yeah… big brother is watching.

WAR: “This is what made me a Libertarian.” “Government is corrupt.” Under a Root Administration? “Patriot Act – GONE; Warrantless wiretaps – GONE; REAL ID… no way Jose, OUT!” He should be selling some kind of cleaner on an infomercial. Now he wants to privatize the war on terror. I’m thinking bad thoughts about this guy.

BB: Worked with ACLU and ACU to “drive a stake through the heart of the Patriot Act.”

GP: “The government is reading almost every email sent.” Really? How boring for them.

MJ: (gets a laugh with) “How can you not like the Patriot Act?” Says he’s “running for President to “educate the American people.” Thanks, I sure is learnin’.

Question Six: Immigration

SK: “Our immigration policy is the same as I would expect from the KKK.” Important to keep in mind though, Mr. Kubby, that the KKK is not an enemy – merely a competing ideology, right?

WAR: I don’t know, something dickish about being fine with immigrants as long as they don’t use any social services or end up on welfare.

BB: “We have no immigration policy.”

MG: “We should have no barriers.” Praises Europe, then pivots to Fair Tax.

GP: Second time in the debate someone has felt obligated to “do something real politicians won’t.” We get it. You’re not your average politicians. Still can’t untangle his words and discern his point. I think he’s either for or against open borders.

MJ: Stop beginning your answers by saying you agree with the person who just spoke! This time, he picked Bob Barr to agree with. He also wants to end the welfare state.

MR: Government limits the number of available jobs because of regulation. End regulation and welcome immigrants.

Question Seven: War on Drugs

WAR: “End the war on drugs.”

BB: Pretty much ditto. I’m okay with that, but do you think they realize that if you end the war on drugs, you essentially end a private, untaxed, unregulated industry and establish one that can be taxed and regulated by government? Ironic, huh?

MG: Oh yeah, he’s a big pot guy. I remember that from the Democratic Primary when he recommended to a bunch of New Hampshire High Schoolers that they light up or something like that.

GP: “When I was a little boy…” Here we go. Some prohibition lesson. And then: “Never underestimate the power of human stupidity.” Ya know what George? That’s not something you’ll need to worry about at the moment.

MJ: You gotta be kidding! He agrees with his colleagues again!

MR: “We need to follow the lead of the Netherlands.” That must’ve made Gravel swoon.

SK: “I’m getting a major buzz right now.” Alright, in fairness, the guy does have some credibility on this issue.

Question Eight: Judges

BB: “Libertarian judges.”

MG: “Also Libertarian judges, but more importantly, change the judicial system. They’re appointed for life! They’re Papists!”

GP: “I do this… I do that…” Wants to call up some Libertarian law professor and “ask them to compile a list of Libertarian law professors and to include their own name. That’ll get you a pretty good list.” Um… I’m just thinking, but if you ask them to include their own name, wouldn’t it be human nature to turn in an otherwise fairly weak list? Come on… you guys are supposed to understand this whole “competition” thing. What was it you were saying about the stupidity of humanity?

MJ: “Judicial branch is just as corrupt as the executive and legislative branches.” Wow — these guys don’t just think government is inefficient, to a person, they all think it’s corrupt as well. HE JUST DID IT AGAIN! “I agree with Mike Gravel and all my colleagues here.”

MR: Using way too many words to simply say “I’d appoint Libertarian judges.”

SK: “Don’t even like the concept of the Supreme Court.” Hehe… he just unintentionally referred to Marbury v. Madison as “Mayberry v. Madison.” Then, without any irony, said the Supreme Court is made up of “idiots.”

WAR: “Follow the Constitution.” He just referred to education as his “niche” issue. That’s not something you should generally have to point out if you really do own the issue… Now he’s paraphrasing Charlton Heston: (shouts) “over my cold, dead fingers!” regarding the Supreme Court telling him how to educate his kids. Wow.

Question Nine: Health Care and the FDA

MG: Ding! 60 seconds, 10 uses of the word “free” or “freedom.” That’s gotta be a record. Then he pivots again – this time to education. Says we are a “dumb population.” Seems to be a theme with these guys. Maybe its just the company they keep.

GP: “I’m going to propose answers Americans can understand.” Right… just after you explain Cicero to us.

MJ: Yay! “The American people are not stupid.” That’s refreshing. They’re “smarter than we think they are.” And then… “deregulate the health care industry.” Damn. For a second, you had me. Then you answered the question.

MR: Parrots deregulation. Wow, I didn’t know that in England and other countries with universal health care seniors who needed treatment were told to “go home and die.” That seems harsh…

SK: “As a cancer patient…” Okay buddy, you’re starting to overplay that credibility card now.

WAR: “Government is the problem, not the solution.” “Answer is Freedom! Answer is Choice! Answer is Competition!” “Tort reform!” See? Complete asshole.

BB: “Almost 50% of medical costs go to cover government regulation, including FDA.”

Question Ten: Gay marriage

GP: “I’m proud to be from Massachusetts.” “States rights were wrong when they took away an African American’s right to vote, and wrong when they take away a homosexual’s right to marry.” Also tosses in a quick pro-choice line.

MJ: It’s not even funny anymore… he “agrees with everything that was just said… why is government even involved in this issue?”

MR: She also agrees with colleagues. Marriage should be a private contract between people.

SK: He’s “perplexed” that government can decide who can marry and who can’t.

WAR: “Can you believe that gays in this country want to get married?” I’m guessing his wife didn’t really need an added argument for divorce, but I think she just got one… “Just kidding… I love my wife…” Then: “None of the governments business to define marriage, period.” Yeah, it’s fitting that he’s the guy that uses the word “period” to punctuate his sentences. That infomercial deal awaits…

BB: Stands up before answering. That’s visually weird. Now he’s apologizing for being the author of the Defense of Marriage Act (DOMA). Now he wants to repeal it. What was that thing about being unfair for people “who come into this country”? Is this somehow tied to the immigration debate in his mind?

MG: “Marriage is a secular term… what is marriage?” Yes… let us muse… “it’s a commitment of love between two human beings. If this world needs something, it needs more love.” That’s deep. I can already hear Dionne Warwick singing in the background.

Question Eleven: How would your nomination help the Libertarian Party?

MJ: Uh-oh, when you get the first crack at the question, there’s nobody you can agree with… “My mentor is Harry Browne.” He enrolled all the American people – some Libertarian issues appeal only to Libertarians, some appeal to all Americans. My campaign is focused on those issues.” Some stuff about the two-party system. Wants to deliver the message of unity.

MR: “I want to get more votes for the Libertarian Party.” Back to the whole “run a principled, Libertarian woman” to get more women involved. Now some more Ron Paul stuff… she just said she’s active in his Meet-up groups. This is near stalker material.

SK: “This party has grown phenomenally in the past few years…” Predicts that one day Hillary Clinton will write a book claiming she’s always been a Libertarian. Says the Party has “leaned too far to the Right,” need to “pick up on the Ron Paul revolution.” Wow – that’s two candidates with Ron Paul crushes. “Insane McCain” reference got some applause. Nice applause line with that “we need someone who will fight for your freedom!”

WAR: “Number One: Voters and constituencies.” “Number Two: Fundraising.” Now he’s bragging about how much money he can bring in. Now bragging about how many online poker enthusiasts consider him a celebrity.

BB: “I have been in the belly of the beast. I have been in Washington.” Now he thinks we’re “on the cusp of a Libertarian era!”

MG: “Who can walk the talk?” Talking about his days in the Senate – I think back in the ’20s. Just yelled that the applause was cutting into his time. They oughta just twinkle. Up, there’s his mantra, “freedom, freedom, freedom!”

GP: “What can I do for the Libertarian Party?” See… even he doesn’t know… Great. Now he’s back to “left wing television and right wing radio.” Let me guess. You have a third way that’s much much smarter than those two. “I’m not going to make fabulous promises… not going to talk about what I might do if elected.” No George, you seem perfectly contented telling us about what you (think you) have done already. And there he goes, “I’ve already reached out to Ron Paul folks…”

Question Twelve: Do you favor the repeal of all gun laws including FDRs attack (or tax) on machine guns? (rapid fire round)

MR: “Yes.”

SK: “Real freedom less likely to come from Congress and more likely to come from Smith and Wesson.”

WAR: “What part of the second amendment don’t the bureaucrats understand?” Whatever part it is, I’m sure Mr. Phillies would be happy to teach it to them.

BB: Another shout-out for “Chuck” Heston. “The second amendment is the first amendment.”

MG: “Leave the second amendment the way it is,” and “the American people have the wisdom to deal with this issue.” Really Mike? I thought we were a “dumb population?”

GP: Still incoherent babbling… I think it’s just random quoting of the 2nd amendment.

MJ: “I own a gun, and no one’s taking it away from me.”

Closing statements:

BB: Spent the day going over the Libbie platform. “No longer should fear be driving public policy, courage should be.” Now he’s quoting Dante. “Big government destroying this country.” So much for not using fear.

MG: Gotta love it when it all comes full circle – Gravel just picked up Phillies’ earlier Cicero reference. We should give power to the American people so they have control over what effects their lives. “They (presumably the dumb population) will be empowered to make the decisions.”

GP: “We’re all great speakers!” Um… think again. “Why should you choose me? My skeletons are all out of the pocket.” Pocket. Bad timing on that “great speakers” comment. And then six sentences in a row (yup, 6) started with “I’m already…”, “I have already…”, or “my press releases already…”

MJ: “Running a government is like running a business, and I’m a CEO.” Ah, Biff.

MR: “I’d like to remind us of our victories.” Seems like that could’ve been accomplished in the rapid response round. She’s talking about how “mainstream” the Libbie position has become. Yikes!

SK: Back to medical marijuana. “Every other candidate has been taking freedom from you… I’m the only candidate who has written and helped to pass a law that increases freedom.”

WAR: “What this Party needs is energy, spirit, passion, dynamic communicator!” Oh… my… God… “Raise your hands! How many of you believe I have energy?!” Scattered applause. He’s standing up now. I think he’s about to take out the whole room. “How many believe that I have passion! Now compare my energy and my passion to an employee of the Department of Motor Vehicles.” Now he’s screaming, “That’s the message!” Oh, here’s a good one: “You know what else this Party needs? A New York street fighter. My hero is Winston Churchill…” I hadn’t realized Churchill was a New York street fighter. Guess that was before he moved to England and told all those old, disease-ridden people to “go home and die.” This man is INSANE.

And that is, mercifully, the end of the debate. I can’t believe these guys are actually gaining in prominence…

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